Jono: She could be so trapped in, I hate my life. I hate my world.
She's finding the wonder and the joy in her circumstances,
even though they're not ideal.
The only way to actually, like, step into your confidence and to stay there
is to recognize, if people reject me, that says everything about them and what they value
and says literally nothing about my worth.
Alan: Understanding that no matter what external forces are acting against you,
you still have intrinsic internal worth.
You are worth what you are worth, and it doesn't matter what anyone else says.
This episode was filmed before the writers and actors strike.
Without their labor, our show wouldn't exist.
We support their strike efforts.
If you'd like to support them as well, go to www.EntertainmentCommunity.org and donate.
Alan: Hello and welcome to Cinema Therapy.
I'm Alan Seawright, professional filmmaker who needs therapy.
I'm joined by...
Jono: Jonathan Decker, licensed therapist who loves movies.
And we have a very special guest with us today. Welcome back.
Sophie: Me.
Alan: "Me" is Sophie Telles, also a professional filmmaker.
Also... In need of therapy.
Jono: Why Howl's Moving Castle for Cinema Therapy?
Alan: Is it your favorite movie ever?
Sophie: It might be my favorite movie ever.
I watched it five times in one day.
Jono: What?! Sophie: Also did that to Spider-verse. So like, I'm not discriminating.
Jono: Did you have Covid or were you just like, This is what I'm doing today? Sophie: No. I got just sick one day...
Sophie: It's because I get to hear Christian Bale say, Sophie, you're beautiful...
Howl: And now I've got something I want to protect.
It's you.
Sophie: I love Miyazaki. He's just a beautiful storyteller.
Jono: What pops out at you about this story?
Sophie: Probably that she's not confident. Neither am I.
Jono: Okay. And when you hear Christian Bale say, Sophie, you're beautiful... Sophie: And also that.
Jono: ...you surge in confidence.
Alan: You suddenly turn into a young woman again with gray hair?
Sophie: I'm totally not attracted to a cartoon character...
Alan: I never have been either.
Certainly not in this film.
Jono: Yeah, me neither.
Don't judge me.
Lettie: Wow. He must have been a wizard then.
Sophie: But he was so kind to me.
He rescued me, Lettie.
Lettie: Of course he did. He was trying to steal your heart.
You were so lucky, Sophie. If that wizard were Howl, he would have eaten it.
Sophie: No, he wouldn't. Howl only does that to beautiful girls.
Jono: Ohhh...
Lettie: You need to be more careful... Alan: Says obviously cute girl with gorgeous Emily Mortimer's voice.
Lettie: ...is back on the prowl.
Jono: It's the bangs.
Lettie: Are you listening?
Sophie: I was literally just going to say that.
Alan: They're not... Sophie: That fringe is whack.
Alan: They're not doing any favors.
Sophie: The physics of this is also wack to me.
Alan: Oh, how he can remove a box...?
Sophie: Just removes a box from the middle.
Alan: Everything's totally fine.
Sophie: All right. I better get going then.
I just wanted to make sure that you were doing okay.
Alan: She's so kind.
Sophie: So basically, what happened before this is Sophie is walking around,
is harassed by two soldiers, and Howl comes and saves her.
And there's all of this, you know, like...
lore and legends around how he eats beautiful women's hearts.
Jono: But instead of being, like, good thing for me, I'm not beautiful, so I'm still alive.
She's like, Awww...
Sophie: Yeah.
Jono: ...I wish I were pretty so I could get cannibalized. Like, it's weird.
Like I say, it doesn't make any sense.
Sophie: We all feel love in different ways.
Jono: Okay, well, you see me after the episode.
Sophie: That one wasn't... That wasn't, like, a deeper meaning one.
That was... I was just trying to make people...
Anyways, next clip.
Sophie: Um...
Sophie: I'm sorry, but the shop's closed now, ma'am.
I could have sworn I locked that door. I must have forgotten.
Witch: What a tacky shop.
I've never seen such tacky little hats.
Yet you're by far the tackiest thing here.
Jono: Rude.
Sophie: I'm afraid you will have to leave now.
Alan: Did you see who the voice is for the Witch of the Waste?
Jono: No.
Alan: Lauren Bacall.
Jono: Really?
Alan: Yeah.
Alan: Dude, the cast in this is bananas.
Sophie: It's stacked.
Alan: So good.
Witch: Standing up to the Witch of the Waste.
That's plucky.
Sophie: The Witch of the Waste...?
Jono: Oh, my gosh. I can't...
Witch: The best part of that spell is you can't tell anyone about it.
My regards to Howl.
Alan: I love the exposition in this movie where it's just like, ...and here's a rule.
Sophie: By the way...
Alan: Also, these guys with the weird goopy, gelatinous legs...
Oh, so much fun.
Sophie: Oh...
[gasps and groans]
Jono: Oh, my gosh. The animation is so...
Just for sassing her.
Jono: Well, the Witch of the Waste is jealous. Sophie: ...isn't it?
Jono: Because Howl had showed an interest in her. Alan: Yeah.
Sophie: The whole idea with her ageing is that we are seeing, like,
a physical manifestation of her confidence. And, like, her...
Alan: Her internal...
Sophie: Her self-worth. Yeah, her...
Alan: Like, self perception.
Sophie: Yeah. Yeah. So, like, right now, she's very timid. She's very...
Jono: As a young woman... Sophie: ...low confidence and stuff. So like...
Jono: And in this moment, obviously, she's horrified,
but she starts acting like an older, mature woman.
Sophie: She gets so chill about it so fast.
Alan: So fast.
Sophie: I would too.
Sophie: One nice thing about getting old is nothing frightens you.
Alan: Check out even more in an extended Director's Cut on our Patreon.
And we have so much more cool stuff that we want to bring you.
Like early access to ad-free extended Director's Cuts of our episodes,
exclusive Discord server access,
exciting behind-the-scenes and bloopers,
extra Crying with Alan and a whole lot more.
Go to Patreon.com/CinemaTherapy and join today.
You'll be our hero.
Logo...
Jono: I look at this psychologically as if you're dealt a bad hand,
you find a gear that you didn't know you had because you kind of have to, right?
How many shy people who lack confidence, when the moment arrives
and they need to stand up for something, they find it.
And she, at this point, like, talks to the Witch of the Waste.
She stands up to her, doesn't know it's the Witch of the Waste,
but she's just kind of tired of being pushed around.
And I think that's her first step into her confidence, is she realizes,
Huh, I'm not feeling this self pity stuff anymore.
I'm kind of done with it.
Taking it from everybody else, including myself. I'm not going to take it from you. And then...
Sophie: She finds a lot of her worth in her craft. Alan: Yes.
Sophie: Like her hat making. Right?
So when the witch comes in and she's like, Oh, this is tacky.
And you see her automatically be like, Get out. Like...
Jono: Yeah, don't you dare.
Sophie: Like, same.
Like, you can come for me as a person, but if you came for my work,
I'd be like, No. That's where I draw the line.
Sophie: Oh, incredible. Calcifer!
Calcifer! Are you the one moving the castle?
Calcifer: Of course I am. No one else does any work around here.
Sophie: I am thoroughly impressed.
You're a first class fire demon. I like your spark.
Calcifer: She likes my spark.
Jono: She thinks I'm cute!
Affirmation goes a long way, right? That's the point of that clip.
Sophie: That's literally my love language.
Jono: Something I see about Sophie and Sophie... She's been turned into an old woman.
She can't tell anybody about it.
Separated from her family.
We've talked before about radical acceptance, right?
The concept of whatever hand you're dealt, you make the best of it
instead of complaining or trying to change the hand.
But she. She does that. Like you say, she accepts, Well, crap... All right. And then...
Alan: Okay. I guess I'm going to go be a housekeeper for this weird wizard
that everyone is terrified of.
Sophie: She leaves her family so easily. Can we talk about that? She just leaves.
She's gone.
Jono: In fairness, her mom's not the best.
Sophie: I'd leave easily, too.
Jono: But I love the positive attitude here.
Like, she could be so trapped in, I hate my life. I hate my world. I hate my reality.
I hate, I hate, I hate.
And instead she's like, You're such a good fire demon.
I like your spark. This is amazing.
And she's finding the wonder and the joy in her circumstances,
even though they're not ideal.
And to me, that is a sign of resilience. That's something to learn from Sophie.
Sophie: She's starting to de-age, like, just a little bit.
Alan: Yeah, she's getting more spry.
Sophie: Yeah. When she first has changed, that's the amount of detail of the lines and stuff.
Sophie: I think that's the only time that it's, like, that deep. Jono: Yeah.
Howl: I'm tired. Make some hot water for my bath.
Calcifer: What? Not again.
Jono: Where's the Batmobile?
Sophie: Where's the trigger?
Jono: Where's the trigger?
You wouldn't give it to an ordinary citizen.
And here she's herself again.
I didn't understand why.
Sophie: This is probably why I sleep all the time.
Just unburdened by the world when you're asleep.
Jono: Imagining... hot wizard Christian Bale just staring at you like Edward Cullen.
Sophie: Yeah, until I have the nightmares.
Jono: Why this clip?
Sophie: I think in sleep is the only time that she's just truly unburdened by, like, her...
Herself, you know, perspective on herself and, like, the world.
Alan: Well, and I think what we're also seeing is that Howl sees her for who she really is as well.
He can see past the curse that's, you know...
Jono: Been placed on her. Alan: Been placed on her.
Jono: Yeah. Okay.
Alan: I guess. I don't know because nothing in this movie made sense.
Jono: Again. Alan: But it's great.
Jono: It's an inkblot. Alan: I love it.
That means whatever the hell you want it to mean.
Sophie: Also, just like a random thought, I just realized she's never...
There's never, like, a time where she truly feels like she wants to tell anyone about the curse.
Other than I think when she's, like, mad and she's just, like...
...going off and she's like, The stupid Witch and whatever,
and she can't keep... Like, she doesn't feel the need to tell people.
Like, Oh I'm young and beautiful...
Alan: The rest of the time, she seems totally fine about it.
Sophie: She's just, like, enjoying it.
Alan: I'm just a lady who's your housecleaner. It's cool.
Jono: She sees herself as plain.
So what's the difference if I'm young and plain or old and plain,
it doesn't really matter.
And Howl sees the inner beauty.
Madame Suliman: If not, I'll strip him of all his powers. Just like her.
Sophie: That is enough!
Now I understand why...
Sophie: It's quality. Alan: This little flying chicken dog.
Sophie: It's a trap. You lure people here with an invitation from the king,
and then you strip them of all their powers.
Howl would never be so heartless.
He may be selfish and cowardly, and sometimes he's hard to understand.
But his intentions are good. He just wants to be free.
Howl won't come here. He doesn't need your help.
He can fix his problem with his demon on his own. I'm certain of it.
Madame Suliman: Now I understand. You're in love with Howl.
Sophie: [gasps] Witch: Howl?
Did you say Howl's coming?
I want his heart. His heart belongs to me.
Sophie: Stop that.
Calm down. Howl is not coming here, okay?
Alan: The weird melted Witch of the Waste is...
...so great.
Sophie: We didn't... We didn't see the little page boys.
There's a whole other horror movie, I think. Just them.
Just those little page boy minions in the palace. They're creepy.
Jono: So she de-ages because she's stepping into her confidence, right?
And so when she ages, it's showing that she feels decrepit and weak.
Sophie: Yeah.
Jono: And when she...
Alan: Well, and she feels self-conscious.
I think that's why when this witch says, Oh, I see you're in love with Howl,
she immediately reverts back to old.
Sophie: I don't have a crush. What?
Alan: Well, it's because she's picturing herself, you know, saying that to Howl.
And she's like, Oh, no, I could never.
Jono: Yeah.
Alan: The self-confidence immediately evaporates.
Jono: But it's very true. Like, listen, this is total adolescent thinking, though.
When she lists all of his character defects and then she goes, But his intentions are good.
And it was like, "I see you're in love with him". "What? No".
But that is such a teenage way of thinking. Like, sure.
Sophie: He's a slob and he kind of sucks.
Jono: And he's kind of verbally abusive and, you know, like...
But he's good in his heart.
But the thing is, like, in the story, of course, Howl actually is good in his heart,
but he also goes out as condorman and does some amazing battle stuff.
So he's pretty cool.
Madame Suliman: So nice to see you again, Howl.
Howl: You're looking well, Madame Suliman.
Madame Suliman: Rather weak disguise. Didn't I teach you better?
Howl: I'm not trying to outwit you. I kept my oath. I reported when summoned.
Sophie: My gosh, we've matching hair... Howl: Now, Mother and I will go.
Madame Suliman: I'm afraid not.
Alan: I do love how the magic works in this world, which is to say,
however the hell it wants whenever it wants to.
Sophie: And it can keep doing that.
Jono: The Witch of the Waste, just like...
Howl: I'll distract them. Then you can fly this thing back to my castle in the Wastes.
Sophie: Howl, I don't know the way.
Howl: Hey, don't worry. The ring that I gave you will guide you back home.
All you have to do is summon Calcifer with your heart.
Alan: Because I decided.
Jono: You're right, the exposition in this is just like...
Sophie: It's glowing.
Howl: Just keep following that...
Sophie: My favorite genre of magic called "Why not". Alan: Yeah.
Sophie: Why did you make me come here, if you were coming yourself?
Howl: Knowing you'd be there gave me the courage to show up.
That woman terrifies me. I can't face her on my own.
You saved me, Sophie. I was in big trouble back there.
Jono: Makes you feel good, doesn't it?
Hear Christian Bale say those words.
Alan: Huh? Huh?
Sophie: I'm not gonna discuss that with you.
Alan: This is not a... This is not a work appropriate conversation.
Sophie: That's Patreon content.
Howl: We've got a good lead now.
I can give you five minutes of invisibility, so use it wisely.
Jono: Why five minutes?
Alan: I don't know.
Why can I suddenly magically split this into two things?
Sophie: He's a wizard.
Where's your whimsy, you guys?
Alan: No, that's what I'm saying. It all works. It shouldn't.
It's objectively dumb and nonsensical, and it's beautiful. And I love it. And more, please.
Jono: So he says that you saved me, I didn't have the courage to face her alone.
And Sophie has seen herself as weak, and she's seen herself as incompetent,
and she's seen herself as of no consequence.
And here the greatest, allegedly cannibalistic, super wizard that there is
with a really hot voice and amazing eyes...
...what a combo...
...is telling you, You helped me find my courage.
He doesn't eat hearts, though, does he? Isn't that just what the people say?
Sophie: I think it's just he's a ladies man.
Jono: Yeah, yeah. Alan: Yeah.
Jono: But he's not humoring her or even flirting with her.
He's being serious.
Sophie: Yeah. Alan: Yeah.
Jono: Which is kind of the trope of the bad boy. But he meets the right woman, and...
Sophie: He's a reformed bad boy.
Jono: And maybe that's what the moving castle is all about,
is that he won't settle down and make a home until he meets Sophie.
And then the castle stays put.
Sophie: You just busted this wide open.
Jono: Boom.
Jono: Yes, he's a bit of a hoarder, but his intentions are good...
Alan: Yes. He lives in a mud cave that's packed with feathers,
but his intentions are good.
Jono: Just drop the candle. Just drop it right on him.
Sophie: Howl, is that you?
Howl: [laboured breathing]
Sophie: Are you in pain? Tell me what's happening.
Howl: Go away.
Jono: That's so Batman.
Sophie: I'm going to help you break the spell that you're under.
Howl: You...
You can't even break your own spell.
Sophie: But you don't understand. I love you.
Howl: You're too late.
Sophie: I probably would have slapped him if he said that to me.
Sophie: Howl, no!
Jono: So she feels confident enough
to stand up for herself and to express her vulnerability.
And then he rejects her and.
Alan: She's immediately old again.
Jono: Flees the coop, as it were.
Sophie: Her fringe is growing out.
Jono: Yeah.
Sophie: She's learning some haircare.
Jono: She's... [laughs]
Alan: Calcifer moonlights as a...
Jono: As a stylist.
Jono: Right now, her confidence is still dependent on...
She'll find it and then she'll lose it. Why does she keep losing it?
Jono: Because she feels attacked or rejected by other people. Alan: Yes.
Jono: And the only way to actually, like, step into your confidence and to stay there
is to recognize, Okay, if people reject me,
that says everything about them and what they value
and says literally nothing about my worth and my personal worth. Alan: Yeah.
Jono: Right? And she's not there yet.
She's still reliant on other people to feed into that.
And she's got to get to a place where she has enough love and confidence in herself to sustain it.
Because if you put that trust in other people, it's a shaky foundation.
Sometimes people have a bad day.
Sometimes people don't value who you are because of their own biases. Right?
And it has nothing to say about who you are or what your worth is.
Very similarly, my biggest setbacks happen with rejection
Sophie: ...because, like, other than that, I'm usually fine. Jono: Yeah.
Sophie: A lot of chaos follows me and I just kind of live with it.
Like, I have confidence in just about every aspect of my life except for, like, dating.
It's interesting where we put our different, like, where we put our value, you know.
Because, like, I do get a lot of value out of like the work that I do
and, like, my creative work and like...
You know, a love life is something that I'd like, but I should also, like, not...
...balance everything on that because that's not working out for me.
But everything else is so, like...
Alan: Well, and understanding that no matter what external forces are acting against you,
you still have intrinsic internal worth.
YOU are worth what you are worth, and it doesn't matter what anyone else says.
And that's... When she is in that space is when she's young and her fringe is growing out
Alan: ...and Calcifer's do is looking really good. Sophie: Yeah.
Alan: And when it's not is when she ages again. Sophie: Yeah.
Sophie: I don't know if this sounds bad, but I lived with my grandma....
...before she died of Alzheimer's. And every time I see that clip, I see her.
Sophie: Like, that is... Alan: That's...
Sophie: ...kind of where we were at the end. Alan: Yeah.
Witch: What a pretty fire.
Sophie: Howl...
Alan: I just love that this horrible woman who's trying to destroy everything...
She's feeding her.
Sophie: Yeah, It's very much like, Well, why not care about them?
Sophie: Like, they're still people, like... Jono: Yeah.
Sophie: You know, this person cursed her.
Sophie: She left her family, like, went away. Jono: Yeah.
Sophie: And she's sitting there spoon feeding her and she helped her up the steps
and she helped her get out and, like, it's insane.
Jono: Yeah. Well, and she also, I mean, and I think it's super noble
when she helps her up the steps
because she's still dealing with the Witch of the Waste who was awful to her.
Sophie: She's smack talking her the whole way up. Jono: Yeah.
Sophie: She's all like, Come on, you can do it. Like, I'd be pushing her down the stairs.
Sophie: Too bad I'm not younger or I'd lend you a hand.
Jono: At this point. The Witch of the Waste, who is cruel to her, is gone.
Like the... Has mentally devolved there.
And she's just taking care of, like, this innocent creature, you know,
that just sits before her that can't feed herself.
You know, it's very sweet.
Sophie: Well, she's lost her power. And like...
I think that, in a way, like, she's lost her power over Sophie,
even though she's still, like, aging and stuff.
Jono: She can't undo the curse.
Sophie: She can't undo it. Like, she's still, in a way, like, lost that power over her. And that's...
Jono: Yeah. Sophie: Yeah.
Jono: That makes me think of, Okay, who do I want to be like?
I've heard it said, We don't treat others with respect because of who they are.
Jono: We treat them with respect because of who we are. Alan: Yeah.
Jono: Right? And Sophie, in this case, she says, This is a person who hurt me.
I'm not going to let it get to me. I'm a kind person. I'm a good person.
And if I lose that, then I lose me.
So it really doesn't matter what the Witch of the Waste did
or what she deserves.
What matters is how am I going to show up so I can look myself in the mirror.
Sophie: Yeah.
Well, and I think like a lot of, you know, all of these characters have like an arc
and like, Sophie has one as far as, like, stepping up for herself,
Sophie: ...but, like, who she is as a person never changes. Jono: Yeah.
Sophie: Like, that core is still always there.
Alan: And here the Witch of the Waste has stolen... Sophie: Howl needs that back now.
Witch: Don't look at me. I don't have it. I don't...
Sophie: Yeah. She found out Calcifer is his heart. Alan: Howl's heart, Calcifer...
Sophie: And Sophie had to pour water on it because it was burning her.
Witch: You really want it that badly?
Sophie: Yes.
Witch: All right, then. You'd better take good care of it. Sophie: Okay.
Alan: Sophie's not raging. She's not upset. She just says "please" and gives her a hug.
Jono: There's no tug of war.
Alan: And then tells her, You have a big heart.
Sophie: When she so easily could just shoved her off of this.
Alan: Yeah.
Jono: Give me the heart and push her. Sophie: Yeah.
Jono: Kindness is a superpower,
and it doesn't always change the minds and hearts of the people you're dealing with.
But it tends to more often than criticism or judgment or attacking someone does.
Alan: It's the most successful plan for that.
Jono: You have the highest batting average with kindness, doesn't mean it always works.
But it is Sophie's superpower. It's fantastic, both on screen and off.
Sophie: Oh, my gosh...
This is... This helped the most when I worked in a mental health crisis.
But like, just about every job I've had,
Sophie: I am always the one that is sent to, like, deescalate. Jono: Yeah.
Sophie: Because I know how to talk to people in a way that, like...
Even if it is their fault, like, isn't super attacking.
Jono: They don't feel judged...
Sophie: Unless I'm talking to Alan, I can attack him. It's fine.
Jono: Yeah.
Alan: And she does. Sophie: He can handle it. And I do.
Sophie: But there is an art to peacefully... Jono: Yeah.
Alan: Yeah, for sure.
Sophie: ...dealing with, you know, situations and people.
Jono: And I think the art of it is you have to mean it.
Like if you show up and you're patronizing people,
and you're acting non judgmental, but it's clear that you're just kind of going through the motions.
See, what you have is you have a sass and a fire to you,
which means that when you're being real...
No, but when you're being real with people and you're de-escalating,
it doesn't come across as like an act or someone who...
Sophie: Like patronizing or...
Jono: Or someone who's being like, like, super nice and genteel.
Like, you'll call people on their crap.
But the realness of it means, like, Okay, I'm not being judged.
Sophie: They're not going to throw a punch at me.
Jono: Yeah, well, because they're not being judged, you're literally just describing what you're seeing. Sophie: Yeah.
Alan: In interpersonal relationships like that, people have...
...generally such strong bull[beep] detectors.
Jono: Yeah. Yeah.
Alan: Like, you can sniff that out from a million miles away.
Alan: But if people are being genuine, you can feel that too. Jono: Yeah.
Alan: People aren't necessarily good at telling when other people are lying,
but people can always tell when people are being condescending.
Jono: Yeah. And that's, you know, the real life Sophie that we have with us has got fire.
But you've also got kindness and goodness.
This, Sophie, I would say, is a lot more gentle, right?
And sweet. But that's...
Sophie: She wouldn't say half the things I've said to you.
Jono: No, but... But that's her nature. Alan: Yeah.
Jono: So like if someone like you tried to approach it the way she does,
it wouldn't register as being genuine. Right? Because it's not her.
It's not your personality.
In her case, giving someone a hug and saying "please" is super powerful
because it's real, not because it's a technique.
And that goes down to something that I've heard...
Dr. Irwin Yalom says in a great book called Love's Executioner.
He's talking about therapy, but it's also true in life.
And he says, screw technique. It's the relationship that heals, right?
And that, okay, the things... your approaches may be worthwhile,
but if people can sense that you actually don't care,
it doesn't matter what approach you're trying.
It's the genuineness and it's the relationship that's actually healing.
I think that's how Sophie heals Howl. It's how she heals herself.
It's how she helps Calcifer and the Scarecrow and the Tin Man and the Lion.
Oh, wait. Sorry. We're just crossing over.
Sophie: The way I didn't even register that you were, it's all like... yeah.
Jono: Yeah. Yeah.
Alan: All of those characters, they're in this movie.
Sophie: There's just completely random... turnip man that shows up.
Alan: You know, she's come full circle here,
and her outward appearance is what is showing her inward,
like, conversion into someone who's confident in herself.
But we see here it's actually a blend of... not just...
She doesn't just look like she did when she was young.
She has the silver hair now. The fringe is better.
She carries herself differently. There's a maturity there that wasn't there before.
Alan: The youthful beauty is back, but tempered by experience and... Jono: Yeah.
Alan: ...this other stuff. So...
Sophie: I was going to say in regards to, like, her being kind to people no matter what,
I think the reason I have such a strong love and connection for this character
is because I see it in a very similar way
where I think she has not always been treated how she would like to be treated.
You know, people haven't always spoken to her as kindly as she would like
or as gently or treated her that way.
And so in return, that's how she treats other people.
Like I... I have a very big rule where I, you know, there's a lot of things that I don't know.
And so one of my biggest pet peeves is when someone goes, Wait, you didn't know that?
And it's very condescending. And so, like... I'll catch, like...
Like my brother said that to someone once and I said, we, like, gently teach them.
Sophie: Like, don't say that. Just tell them what it is. Jono: Yeah.
Sophie: Like, that's such a big thing for me is, like,
well, I didn't have people who were nice to me when they taught me things.
So I try to be very kind when I teach things
and I try to be very gentle in certain situations
because that's how I wish people had treated me in those ways.
Jono: And the fact is, there's no reason to be condescending
Jono: ...because we all don't know stuff that other people know. Sophie: Yeah.
Sophie: My sister and I just directed a short film together
that you can follow either our page, which is Puchica_Productions
or my Instagram, which is just Sooo_Sophie... S-o-o-o_Sophie.
Alan: Yeah. The short is called Body of Work. I produced it. She wrote...
Sophie: With other people, my sister and my friend Rachel.
Alan: ...sister and friend, co-directed with sister. They made a good short. Yeah,
Jono: It's morbid as hell.
Alan: It's super... Sophie: It's very bloody.
Alan: It's quite bloody, but, like, fun bloody.
Sophie: I think we could have made it bloodier, but...
Sophie: I'll never get there with these legs.
At least my teeth haven't fallen out yet.